Using The Laws of Attraction To Navigate Health & Wellbeing – Ep#028 Interview With Lorna Gager, Metaphysical Life Coach

Today’s show is a thought provoking discussion about the Laws of Attraction and how understanding them may be the key to navigating our health and well being in these rapidly changing times.

Ancient medicine, natural healing and Law of Attraction all understand that well being is a function of the interconnection of our mind, body and consciousness.

My special guest today is my dear friend and soul sister, Lorna Gager, Mastery Life Coach whose gift and passion has been guiding women for the past decade to have more ease and flow in life working with the Laws of The Universe. With deep knowledge expertise in the study of metaphysics, Lorna, otherwise known as the Practical Mystic, is known for her heart centered, spirit based, no-nonsense coaching.

Click Here to Receive Lorna’s Free eBook:

Lorna’s Recommended Resources for Law of Attraction:

The Seth Material
Matt Kahn

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Thank you so much for listening!

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Podcast Transcript

0 (1s):
Welcome to the Soul Science Nutrition Podcast, where you’ll discover that when it comes to your health, you’re so much more powerful than you’ve been led to believe. And now your host, she’s a Holistic Nutrition and Lifestyle Coach, chef author, and Yogi, Christine Okezie. Hello,

Christine Okezie (23s):
Hello, and welcome to the soul science nutrition podcast. I’m Christina KZ. Thanks so much for being here today. I am so excited for today’s show. Today’s special guest is my dear friend and colleague Lorna Gager. Lorna is a mastery life coach. Who’s been sharing her gifts and passion for helping women over the past decade to have more ease and flow in life, by understanding and working with the laws of the universe with deep knowledge and expertise in the study of metaphysics, Lorna, Gauger otherwise known as the practical mystic is known for her heart-centered spirit based, no nonsense approach to coaching.

Christine Okezie (1m 6s):
So today’s show is a thought provoking discussion about the law of attraction and how understanding the law of attraction or LOA as we’ll refer to. It might just be the ultimate key to navigating our health and wellbeing in these crazy times. See, there’s an intrinsic relationship between the mind body connection and law of attraction. The holistic approach to health recognizes that our bodies respond to our consciousness, our thoughts and emotions with changes in our physiology. For example, chronic fear and worry. We know from the science creates conditions for dis-ease and limitation in the body while love and compassion, support, healing, and recovery in the body.

Christine Okezie (1m 51s):
You see both LOA and holistic health, understand that what we think and how we feel matters so much when it comes to the quality of our lives. For instance, we talk about on the show, we talk about having a gratitude practice using affirmations, mindfulness rejecting our negative self-talk well, when we’d employ these tools, we’re actually activating the law of attraction to achieve a better experience of life. The basis of LOA is the idea that everything in the universe is made of energy and energy attracts similar energy. So it’s not about what you want or think you deserve.

Christine Okezie (2m 34s):
It’s about the frequency or the vibration that you’re living, thinking, and feeling LOA, ancient medicine, natural healing, all understand that well-being is a function of these interconnections between our body, our mind, and our emotions. Understanding law of attraction simply makes us more aware of our habitual thought patterns and emotional tendencies notice. Perhaps if you vibe more, an optimistic outlook or a pessimistic outlook, when it comes to your body, do you spend time in the frequency of shame and judgment or in the energy of love and appreciation?

Christine Okezie (3m 15s):
We know that this distinction makes a world of difference. So law of attraction is just recognizing the powerful role that our subconscious mind, our unconscious mind plays in shaping our experience of health and life. So my intention in this grounded, honest conversation is to give you some renewed inspiration around how learning, how to harness the power of your thoughts is how you step into your full power. So I ask you to take a pause and ask yourself this, what would it be like if you knew that you truly were the master co-creator of your life?

Christine Okezie (3m 59s):
Hey, Lorna, Gauger welcome to the podcast.

Lorna Gager (4m 2s):
Thank you, Christine. It’s so good to be here.

Christine Okezie (4m 4s):
Yes, yes, yes. So finally months later, I get my soulmate soul buddy, you know, soul sister on the show, and we are going to talk about all the stuff that we love to talk about. So it’s going to be, it’s going to be juicy.

Lorna Gager (4m 19s):
Absolutely. Absolutely. That’s very exciting. Thank you.

Christine Okezie (4m 24s):
Awesome. So for those of us who don’t know your story, I think it’s a really cool place to start. And maybe you could tell us, you know, share us, share a little bit about your journey before personal, before your personal transformation. Like, what was your life like before you discovered or knew anything about law of attraction?

Lorna Gager (4m 44s):
So, before I officially knew about law of attraction, I was someone who was very rigid. I was someone that pushed. I was someone that controlled. I was someone that had to make things happen. And to a large degree, I have to say it worked. I was able to get the things I wanted, but what I found and what eventually led me to transformational work and changing everything about my life was the fact that I got what I wanted, but it didn’t feel good. And, you know, there was a day when I was in my late thirties when I woke up and I said, okay, well, I’ve ticked all these boxes and I have the so-called American dream.

Lorna Gager (5m 35s):
Why doesn’t it feel better than this? Why am I really patently unhappy? And that was a real kind of take stock moment of, and, and really, I, you know, I have to say it was, it was if I can’t be happy, who can. Right. And, and I, I almost want to say it became my mission, you know, like I need to figure this out. Yeah.

Christine Okezie (5m 58s):
Yeah. Thank you. Oh my gosh. And so what changed?

Lorna Gager (6m 3s):
What changed? Well, there was the taking stock and really, you know, admitting to myself that I wasn’t happy because having that controlling kind of perfectionist nature, it was, I’m fine. I’m fine. Everything’s fine. And I’m fine. Yeah. And pushing that out, out to the world and trying to convince myself of it. Right. And so I really had to admit that I wasn’t. Okay. And I started off with a few books that came into my realm that really helped. And then I ended up at a transformational workshop in New York city where I thought I was going to a business workshop and I laughed because my logical, you know, self would never have allowed me to go to that workshop.

Lorna Gager (6m 51s):
Had I known what it was? Yes. And that is the beauty of our universe. Yes. Got me there. And it changed everything. And it showed me how closed I was. It showed me how small my life was. It showed me the fear that I was living in. And I was able to tap back into trust and I was able to tap back into understanding that openness was what I needed and that fear was just keeping me in a cage.

Christine Okezie (7m 19s):
Wow. Okay. So that you started to, you know, understand the power of our emotions in terms of, you know, what were our thoughts and emotions, you know, what’s underlying all of the stuff that we get done, right. Is it really working for us from that perspective? I, you know, you’ve told me a bunch of stories that, you know, when I first, when we first met so many years ago, now you told me, you know, I flow, you know, my life is ease and flow. I, you know, I, I find pennies on the ground and I say, I say, thank you more please. And, you know, I focus on what I want and I recognize when I’m not, when I’m focusing, when I don’t want, but you’ve got some really cool examples early in your journey where quote unquote, using law of attraction, you know?

Lorna Gager (8m 3s):
Yeah. And, and I, you know, to back up a bit, when I learned about law of attraction, I realized that I had been doing it my whole life without knowing what it was called. I have always been someone who visualized. I have always, when I was a little girl, I saw myself in a business suit in heels, walking down the street of a city. And I held that vision in my head for years. And I had no idea how it was getting there, but I did have a knowing that I would, and that’s law law of attraction. Right. Not knowing how, but knowing, you know, keeping the feeling, keeping the vision and, and just kind of leaving it up to the universe as to how you’re going to get there.

Lorna Gager (8m 46s):
And that, you know, ended up being my twenties. Right. Having my career in the city.

Christine Okezie (8m 53s):
Interesting. Yeah. No, it’s true. When we think about stuff, you know, we, we, we’re always, we’re always vibing, right. We’re always putting out those messages. We’re always sending out signals, we’re sending messages. Sometimes we’re just not aware of what we’re doing. And that’s the big thing about law of attraction. Right?

Lorna Gager (9m 10s):
Exactly. And that’s, what’s so important and that’s how we make it part of our lives if we so choose. And this is the part where, you know, we can get into how much we actually create our reality and whether we’re, you know, cause I really think we co-create, but so much of our every day has to do with what we focus on. For a long time, I focused on negative things. I focused on lack. I focused on what was wrong with the world. I focused on what I didn’t have and that didn’t make me feel good. And, and so that was kind of my vibe that I, you know, I was very judgmental.

Lorna Gager (9m 50s):
I, you know, there, there was just, there was a lot of stuff in me that I needed to work through, which is, you know, other parts of my transformation, but that was what I was putting out into the world. And so that was what was really magnified. And so that’s what I saw everywhere. Okay. So when I understood how important those thoughts were, when I understood that, where I put my focus was going to have a very big impact on how I felt. And because I care about how I feel, I started focusing on the good things and I started trying to see the beauty and I started, you know, I’ve always loved nature and nature is always there for us. Right. It never isn’t there. We can always go outside under the sky, you know, even when it’s raining.

Lorna Gager (10m 33s):
Yes. Which it is today. Yes. And you know, and, and when you start to look at the good, then that is what starts to magnify. And you start to realize there’s so much good and people have such good intentions and people do such beautiful things. And it doesn’t mean that the other thing doesn’t still exist, it just means that I want to focus in the place that makes me feel good,

Christine Okezie (10m 57s):
Which is why I think it’s really intriguing to think about this power that we have. Right. Especially now, I mean the whole, you know, notion that we can choose to focus on the positive, we can choose to focus on the good, even though it’s not on the news 24 hours, seven days a week, like all the other stuff right. Is really important right now, but it’s not easy. It’s really not easy.

Lorna Gager (11m 18s):
No, it’s not. And you know, as time goes by and as I learn new things, and I’m always, I’m a lifetime learner and I have found a new teacher this year named Matt Kahn. And he has evolved some of my beliefs around law of attraction. And they’re just like everything else in our world, everything is always evolving and there are new paradigms all the time and it doesn’t negate what I’ve known all along. It just expands on it, which is the definition of raising your consciousness. Yes. And, you know, with kind of the traditional of attraction, it was like, don’t look at the bad stuff. Don’t, you know, don’t touch it, you’re going to attract it.

Lorna Gager (11m 59s):
And there was kind of the superstition around like, Oh, if I look at that, I’m going to, it’s going to come into my life. Yes. And Matt has taught me that that’s not the way it works, you know, and that what we’re doing in that case is really putting the universe in the position of our parents and thinking that are, you know, that there’s this, you know, reward and discipline thing that the universe is doing with us. And it’s simply not true, right. The universe is neutral. Okay. But to go back to the original point, I can look at difficult things now. And I, and I look at things in our world that aren’t the way that I want them to be. And instead of shying away and say, Oh, like, I can’t go near that.

Lorna Gager (12m 41s):
I look at it and I bless it with the opposite vibration. So if I see pain and agony, I bless it with hope and unity, consciousness and health and the things that I wish that it was. And this is something that has really changed the way that I, I am, you know, the way that I walk through my world, because I don’t feel like I have to defend myself from bad vibes. Yes. You know, which is one of these kinds of new age ideas that can be a little destructive and it can be a little pie in the sky in terms of bypassing. What’s like really happening.

Christine Okezie (13m 23s):
Yeah. Bypassing what’s going on around us also within us. Right. So, I mean, the whole, it’s interesting because if we, you know, the first step, as you said, as you make a choice to kind of see, you know, what, what are our tendencies, what are our emotional tendencies? Do we tend more towards the positive or optimistic, or do we kind of stay in the pessimism, you know, energy in that field. And as you said, if we, we can’t, well, you know, there’s a saying that goes, I’m really curious to hear your thoughts on it. What about fake it till you make it? We’ve heard all that kind of stuff around, you know, positivity, positive thinking, you know, what’s the real deal with fake it till you make it.

Lorna Gager (14m 2s):
You know, we have to remember that, you know, law of attraction absolutely exists. Right. It’s there all the time. Every second, it’s like gravity, you don’t have to be thinking about it. You know, it’s like, you don’t walk out your front door and fly,

Christine Okezie (14m 14s):
You know, like gravity is working and you don’t need to believe it. I was like, you don’t have to believe it’s going to work anyway.

Lorna Gager (14m 20s):
Exactly. Same with law of attraction. But we also have to remember that there are many, many other laws of the universe. Okay. Okay. And there’s law of vibration. There’s law of oneness. There’s, you know, there’s a lot of other things that are working at the same time. And so when you think of this, fake it until you make it, you know, one of the other laws of the universe is the law of correspondence, which means, basically says that we have patterns in our lives and that we do the same things over and over. Sure. And so if you can think of a pattern as a vibration, so for instance, I’ll use something that I’ll use an example here. You know, if you’re someone that got yelled at a lot as a kid, and you got your self-worth kind of taken away from you and you bought into that, that becomes a pattern in your life where you’re going to attract people who are going to treat you the same way that you were treated as a child, to give you the opportunity to recognize your own worth and change the pattern.

Lorna Gager (15m 24s):
And so we may be pretending that we’re happy and saying, Oh, only good vibes and everything’s great and everything, but what this pattern is running inside of us. Right. And so then we attract a boyfriend who treats us badly and you know, says really terrible things to us. And we say, but I’m all, I’m all happy, happy. Right, right. Is this happening to me? But, but there are other things going on. And so, so it’s a matter of looking at that pattern and saying, how can I change the pattern? How can I believe in my own worth and make a decision? Like I’m not gonna have people treat me this way anymore, and I’m not going to treat myself this way anymore. And that’s when you finally move through that pattern and stop attracting it.

Christine Okezie (16m 7s):
Amazing. So that kind of gets to that. What you said, superstition thing is the old paradigm of new law of attraction has been well when bad things, quote, unquote happened to me. Right. I must be bad. There’s some, I was, I was in the wrong, I was thinking bad thoughts and you know, I’m being punished for something, right? Yeah.

Lorna Gager (16m 25s):
Yes. And you know, to take another step with it is that we all come into this life with a blueprint and we come in and ahead of time have said, I want to learn about powerlessness. I want to learn about lovability. I want to learn about abandonment. And those things can be playing too. And so if someone gets ill or someone, you know, just bad, you know, quote unquote fad things happening, it could be because of that also. Okay. So law of attraction does not exist in a vacuum. And we need to remember that, you know, none of this has really cut and dry

Christine Okezie (17m 5s):
Law of attraction doesn’t exist in a vacuum. There are other universal laws going on and we tend to have the lens of, you know, kind of dualism or polarity on things. Right. That’s, that’s kind of the limitation that we place. Well, this is good. This is bad. I attracted this. I don’t want to attract that. Right. Right.

Lorna Gager (17m 20s):
Yeah. You know, and that brings you to law of divine order, which is that everything happens with a greater purpose and that everything is happening for us and not to us. And when we can have that, you know, and literally that comes down to faith that comes down to, there is a plan here. I don’t have to know what it is. And sometimes it’s really difficult. And sometimes I struggle and I believe that it is towards a greater purpose. It is that everything is for our growth and learning personally and collectively. Yeah.

Christine Okezie (17m 56s):
And, and that’s kind of the medicine for what we need today to navigate, I think is can’t we might not know the answer. No one knows exactly for sure. You know, how the story goes. But if we can believe that there are these universal laws, there’s a greater learning involved, there’s a greater lesson that’s coming forth. Right. That kind of helps us get out of our own way too. Right. So we don’t go down that rabbit hole.

Lorna Gager (18m 22s):
It, it certainly does for me. I mean, it, I feel like it’s a game changer to understand that everything in the universe is energy that, you know, energy thought energy becomes matter. That matter is energy also. And that energy never dies. That energy only changes once. And so even in what we, as human beings consider worst case scenarios, which is death, right. To recognize that the body dies, but the consciousness, the person who we think we are never does, and that’s not to take away from real grief and real difficulty and how rough this human path can be.

Lorna Gager (19m 5s):
But to also, we can hold that. And at the same time, hold the greater picture. And for me, that is, that is a very soothing way to walk through my dys. Yes. Yeah.

Christine Okezie (19m 18s):
Thank you. Okay. So let’s bring it to today’s, you know, COVID world, did we manifest this?

Lorna Gager (19m 28s):
Yeah, we did. We did today and you know, I don’t, I don’t know if that makes people angry. Everyone’s going to take that based on their view of the world. But you know, in my metaphysical learnings, we, we put out vibration, right. Everyone’s putting out vibration and Christine, you and I, as coaches for years, what have we been telling people? We’ve got to slow down, we’ve got to slow down. This pace is unsustainable. It’s unhealthy. We’re so far away from our true selves.

Christine Okezie (20m 3s):
We’re on autopilot. You know, our minds are running rampant. Yep.

Lorna Gager (20m 7s):
Yup. And what happened? We had this invisible virus that went, you know, covered the entire globe and hit the pause button for everybody. And it’s, you know, when you look at it from the 30,000 foot view, it’s really all inspiring. Because again, this is where we can’t know the, how. Yes. Right. We, we knew that we were going to a tipping point. We knew that things had to change, but who could have predicted that this would be the way that it would have gone down. And, and that’s the beauty and the brilliance of the universe, because, you know, it’s got that handled.

Lorna Gager (20m 49s):
And, and so many people, millions and millions of people have taken stock now and have looked differently at their lives and are trying or figuring out what really matters and what they took for granted. And it’s, it’s all been kind of put upon us in this, in this way.

Christine Okezie (21m 6s):
Yeah. It’s an major consciousness raising event that’s gone on. Whether it makes you look at your own individual life, your relationships, your connection to the planet, state of the planet. Right. All of these new, as you said, thoughts, which are always new energies and new things going out that otherwise would not have been triggered or brought to the surface.

Lorna Gager (21m 31s):
Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. And creating a lot more desire right. Of how we want it to be. And so many people saying, I don’t want to go back to what we called normal. Normal was not great. And you know, what can we create from here? And how can we make it different? And how can we have a more equitable world that works for everybody?

Christine Okezie (21m 51s):
How can we support the consciousness to move in the direction where a love of more balance, of more equitable, you know, connections in our world, how do we do that? How do we create a better world if with, you know, knowing that our thoughts matter? I guess

Lorna Gager (22m 10s):
I love the answer to this question. Yeah. We live in a quantum field. Everything is energy and everything is connected, which means that nothing that we do is invisible. Nothing that we do goes unnoticed. And both the quantum field and mother earth herself is also always observing us. Okay. And so when we put loving kind thoughts out into the world, when we, you know, want good things for people, when we picture an equitable world, when we, you know, I personally have a visualization where I make the, the globe into a heart and I tie a bow around it and I just pour love into it.

Lorna Gager (22m 54s):
And I pour love and light into it. And none of that, all of it matters. Okay. All of it matters and it is all taken in. And one of the wonderful things and science actually backs this up, that when, when we are feeling loving kindness, and we are feeling happy, good vibes, they spread much further than they are much, much more powerful than heavy dark, you know, uncomfortable feelings. Yes. And so when we put that loving kindness out in the world, and when we give our love, and when we think of, you know, a better world, it holds a lot more power than people who are in more difficult spaces of, of resentment and anger and hate.

Lorna Gager (23m 39s):
And you know, some of the other things that are happening. And so it’s kind of like the, the good stuff, overpowers, the darker stuff. Yeah.

Christine Okezie (23m 49s):
There’s obviously there’s so much studies on, you know, the power of prayer and the power of group meditation and actually there’s the frequency of love and what it does in the body versus the frequency of fear. Right? Yeah. So healing, so restorative. Yeah. It’s beautiful. It kind of gives us like a feel good feeling because we’re all, we, we, we can choose how we want to contribute to making the world a better place. Right. So when we don’t necessarily have to be doing, you know, all the active things that, you know, that are obvious, there are a lot more subtle and powerful ways for us to move through this and, and make a contribution.

Lorna Gager (24m 28s):
Yes. Yes. And there, and everyone plays their role. You know, that there are people in the streets and then there are lots and lots of people holding the energy, holding the idea. And we have to remember that nothing starts without an idea. Yes. Everything starts in our minds.

Christine Okezie (24m 45s):
Everything starts with energy, right. Comes forth. Okay. So what are some tools that we can use? What tools that you use, you know, for folks who want to start paying attention more to these universal laws?

Lorna Gager (25m 2s):
I always think that the first tool has to be gratitude. I think that no matter where you are, and even if you are like me and take stock and say, wow, I am really a negative person. I really have pudding, you know, put a lot of negative energy out into the world. And I, which clearly says, there’s a lot of stuff in me that needs to be looked at and healed and loved. Okay. Even in that, you can also look at your life and see how beautiful it is and how much you have and how many good things that you’ve created. And I, I really believe that everybody can do that. There are always things to be grateful for.

Lorna Gager (25m 43s):
And, you know, we can’t really have what we want until we appreciate what we have. And again, that goes to vibration.

Christine Okezie (25m 53s):
Yeah. And, and that’s interesting because being, feeling, you know, grateful shifting our, our, our attention and energy towards, you know, things that we want to have gratitude for it, first of all, it feels good. You know, and obviously it’s, it’s a pretty popular practice these days, but I am continually amazed personally. Like literally, if you just take literally like one minute, you know, and you say, thank you universe, you know, for this day, thank you universe for this bed. I slept with thank you universe for, you know, the people that come into my life and make me smile. Right. Just right there. You’re, you’re, you, you, you change your state, you change your state.

Christine Okezie (26m 35s):
And it’s not to say to your point that there’s still a lot of stuff in the world that is not pretty and really toxic. Right. But why do we always have to be well, because, you know, we have this tendency, I think if we being informed, even I did a, did a show on, you know, do, do you have to be informed? And what does that mean? I need to watch the news. I need to, you know, fill my consciousness with, with as much information as possible what’s going on in the world. And to your point, it doesn’t feel good. Right. So talk to me about feeling good. You, you have a great way of explaining why, why feeling good actually matters. And it’s not about being selfish and narcissistic.

Lorna Gager (27m 19s):
I mean, I really think that everything comes down to how we feel, because that’s how we walk through our days. That’s who we are. That’s how we approach life. That’s how we react to life. And if we don’t feel good, I don’t know. I mean, I, I believe that we are here for happiness and pleasure and excitement and, you know, and it’s not to say I haven’t had a ton of struggle I have, but I still hold the vision of, you know, the joy and the happiness, and that it’s going to always circle back around to that. And that there’s going to be way more of that than there is of the struggle. You know, this is where, you know, EV everything that’s inside of you is going to be mirrored outside of you that as within, so without, and when we talk about tools of law, of attraction, you know, one of the after gratitude, the other is really dealing with our core wounds and dealing with our trauma and dealing with our hurts.

Lorna Gager (28m 16s):
Because if we do not look at those, if we gel over them, if we put on the Rose colored glasses,

Christine Okezie (28m 24s):
It doesn’t,

Lorna Gager (28m 25s):
We’re not going to get where we want to go. We’re not going to get what we want, because that is actually our primary vibration. That’s actually what we’re putting out, even though we’re trying to cover it up, it’s still what is fundamentally in us.

Christine Okezie (28m 39s):
And so people say the law of attraction doesn’t work for me. I tried it, it doesn’t work. Yeah.

Lorna Gager (28m 44s):
Yeah. And that’s a lot of what’s going on. And, you know, money is a good example for this one because you know, so many people say, I want to be a millionaire. I want all this money. And simultaneous, simultaneously believe that money is evil. The money is extremely difficult to come by. The people who have money are greedy and terrible people. And those, you know, you’re, you’ve got one foot on the gas and one foot on the brake and that, and then they say, why doesn’t it work,

Christine Okezie (29m 13s):
Work? And what about health? You know, so again, we’re living in an, in an age where our health issues are, are really being brought to the forefront, physical health, certainly mental and emotional challenges as well. Did we bring this on ourselves? How do we not go into that little pity pot or feeling, you know,

Lorna Gager (29m 36s):
And well, listen, I mean, you know, as one of my closest friends that I have had a full year now of health issues after being a pretty Uber healthy person for the first 49 years of my life, and yes, you know, and if I had gone into that superstition of I attracted this, what did I do wrong? Why am I being punished? I don’t think that would’ve helped me very much. And it’s not to say I didn’t do that at the beginning. I will admit that I was kind of like, what is going on here? But what I have come to learn is that there was no other way for me to learn what I learned in being ill than by being ill.

Lorna Gager (30m 18s):
And I uncovered some very subtle superiority complex things that I had about my health, and that’s hard to admit, but it’s true. And the only way that I was ever going to be able to understand that and raise my consciousness and change my perspective around it was to have an illness that took me over. And I, there was nothing I could do about it that I had to simply wait for it to run its course. And I mean, there are some steps that I’ve taken, but, you know, for the most part it’s been in charge, I have not been in control and I’ve just had to let it take its course.

Lorna Gager (30m 60s):
And so, yeah, I got what I needed. Right. I got my soul lesson, I got my understanding and I will never see a sick person in the same way that I did before this happened to me. Amazing. And for that, I am so thankful. Yeah.

Christine Okezie (31m 18s):
Amazing. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah. So I like the way that you said it’s, it’s the lesson, you know, and, and sometimes the lesson has to come the way it comes because that, that is actually, you know, the only way or the most effective way for us to raise our consciousness and evolve. Yeah. Yeah. And it changes our relationship with so many things. Right. I mean, so, you know, I think to get rid of the, the myth around law of attraction, which is if I can make myself sick, you know, because of where I’m thinking about, you know, I can just directly think myself well, and that gets a little dicey too. Right. So I want to talk about like, you know, when it comes to illness or challenge, you know, in the body, we, I think it’s about changing the relationship we have with what’s going on, you know, the meaning that with what’s going on, and that creates the, all the other changes that can help you heal and restore yourself.

Christine Okezie (32m 20s):
Right. It’s not some woo. It’s really kind of, what’s your relationship with what’s happening to me?

Lorna Gager (32m 26s):
Yes. Yes. And I think, you know, have I been picturing myself in perfect health? Absolutely. Yes. But I also have not been struggling against what is okay. And I have been understanding that there is a greater purpose to this and that there is greater learning and growth in the struggle. And so by not fighting against it, I think that it helps me move through it much more easily than my old self who would have been fighting and kicking and screaming and saying why me and

Christine Okezie (32m 57s):
You know, all of that.

Lorna Gager (33m 1s):
And you kind of accept it with an, almost an, a state of grace and it’s, it’s not comfortable and it’s not fun and it’s been a rough year, but I still find so much to be thankful for. And I do visualize myself back in full health and know that that will happen. And I’m, it’s not up to me that, you know, that’s the other part that I have learned how to live.

Christine Okezie (33m 24s):
Okay. But what’s the difference between manifesting something and then making stuff happen.

Lorna Gager (33m 33s):
I think this comes back to pushing and forcing our will onto things. And we have so many type, a perfectionist type of people in the world, myself being a former one. Yes. And kind of thinking that that’s the way you have to do things you have to make it happen. And the difference between that and manifestation is having the desire, visualizing it, visualizing it, kind of letting it go out into the universe, believing that it’s going to come back to you, but not needing to know how, and that gets people into, but don’t, you have to do something and yes you do, but the universe will bring that to you as well.

Lorna Gager (34m 18s):
And that goes into something, we called call inspired action. And it’s not action for the sake of forcing something it’s action that you, something has been kind of downloaded into you that says, this is going to get me to toward this vision of what I want. And it’s kind of like you can’t not do it. And so you take that action in the world.

Christine Okezie (34m 40s):
Yes. So much of this work is about listening to your gut and listening to that, you know, kind of quiet, inner voice inside of you, that always knows what the right thing to do is right.

Lorna Gager (34m 52s):
and people get confused by that too, because if you have a lot of wounding, and if you have a lot of things inside of you that you haven’t looked at and brought out into the light and, you know, brought in for compassion and love, people aren’t necessarily in touch with their intuition. They don’t know the difference between intuition and fear. They don’t know when it’s a download. That is really something for them versus something that they’re just reacting to avoid something else.

Christine Okezie (35m 21s):
Yeah. Yeah. So to your point, you know, I think it gives us a new lens into our stuff, you know, in terms of what, you know, our core wounding, our trauma, our, our negative thought patterns. And it gives us a way to, to really kind of bring it into the fold and work with it in a very therapeutic way. Yes,

Lorna Gager (35m 44s):
Yes. And I used to think that you really had to go digging for it. You had to seek it out and you had to uncover it. And I got to deal with this. And, and the fact of the matter is you can do that. And I did do that for a long time, but what really happens is that life brings you, you what you need to look at. And, and it goes back to those patterns that we were talking about, you know, when, when you end up saying things like, why does this always happen to me? Right. You know, that is something that is asking for you to look at it and asking for your consciousness to make some changes around it and feel differently around it. And life will beautifully show you places that still need your attention.

Christine Okezie (36m 24s):
If we’re awake, if we’re moving through the lens of, you know, what am I here to learn? You know, what’s, what’s the next growth opportunity than I need to pay attention to. Yes,

Lorna Gager (36m 34s):
Absolutely. And I can look back at places where the universe was tapping me on the shoulder saying, Hey, you know, you want to pay attention to this. You want to maybe learn this and I wasn’t ready and we’re not ready to we’re ready. Beautiful. But you know, for the people that are, it’s a, it’s a lovely, beautiful expanding journey.

Christine Okezie (36m 55s):
Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Okay. So you get what you need, not necessarily what you want. Right. So tell me about that. That’s kind of interesting.

Lorna Gager (37m 5s):
Yeah. So

Christine Okezie (37m 7s):
I think that if we go back

Lorna Gager (37m 9s):
Back to the money thing, right. And people say, Oh, I want a million dollars. I want millions of dollars. And, and the fact is that, you know, a lot of people, if they were to get a huge windfall would not know what in the world to do with it and would maybe not feel worthy of it and would maybe, you know, and you see this in people that win a lottery sometimes, right? The people that, you know, and then they’re, they’re broke again. And you kind of say, what in the world happened there. And they didn’t have the logistical tools to know how to handle money, but they also didn’t have the belief that they were worthy of this money and that they could have that life. And because it all fell on them at once, they didn’t know what to do with it. And so sometimes it makes a lot more sense for the universe to bring things to us gradually so that we can get used to it.

Lorna Gager (37m 56s):
Right. I mean, Christine, we joke about, you know, processing, right? Like we need to process things. We need to integrate. We need to allow ourselves to get used to being bigger than who we were and whether that’s a new job or a new relationship or a new house or a new neighborhood, you know, anything that’s new is something that needs to be adjusted to. And that we, you know, we’ve all been in that situation where we feel like we’re just faking it and I don’t belong here. Like what, what am I doing here? Right. Then the more that you’re in it, and the more comfortable you get with it that you’re like, Oh yeah, I do belong here. And then, and then maybe you can take the next step and then you get the next thing that you need.

Lorna Gager (38m 35s):
Wow. Wow. That’s

Christine Okezie (38m 36s):
A game changer, you know? Yeah. So in other words, because we all get so focused on, you know, what we define as getting what we want. It’s like, when this happens, then I’ll be happy when this happens, then I’ve arrived. Right. What are some books or resources that did help you learn about LOI?

Lorna Gager (38m 56s):
Wow. So I, I talked about Matt Khan. He’s my most recent, I found Abraham Hicks, which led me to the Seth material, which Seth material is really kind of my MCE. That’s the place I go back to time and time again, it’s their books from the seventies and eighties, if you can believe that. That’s amazing. Yeah. I mean, it is, except that you think that this information has actually gone down through the history of time that’s right. That there are doers and mystics who have talked about this forever. It always makes us laugh. Christine writes that they call it new age.

Christine Okezie (39m 35s):
Yeah, yeah, exactly. You know, mindfulness self-compassion

Lorna Gager (39m 41s):
Yes. These are not new concepts. They’re not new concepts. Yeah. Yeah. Those are, those are good places to start to start to,

Christine Okezie (39m 48s):
You know, kind of use the tools or, or bring a new level of understanding to ourselves, which is really what this work is all about. And that’s why I love that. You know, now speaking of other universe laws, the one that’s coming to mind right now is dovetailing with the work around being present and working with what is right. It’s that there’s always, whatever whatever’s happening now is correct. The present moment is always perfect. Right? If you will, right. That one’s really, to me, the one that you get, we get to practice all the time, you know, 20, 20, you know, you and I get on the phone and we talk about, ah, I don’t know, this is crazy.

Christine Okezie (40m 40s):
I don’t know. Right. And, and it’s such a struggle. Or, or, you know, maybe that’s too strong a word cause you know, we’ve been on this path. Well, it’s happening. I can’t believe this is happening, but you know what it’s happening.

Lorna Gager (40m 53s):
Yeah. Yeah. And we can choose, we can, we can choose to go with it or we can choose to struggle against it. And you know, struggle is few tiles. This, this is so much bigger than any, any one person, anyone, even one nation, right. This is literally about the entire world. And everything is shifting. Things are changing at the most rapid speed that we’ve maybe have ever seen on the planet. Right. And you know, to go against that, you know, you’re really swimming upstream in a massive way. And I don’t know why we would do that to yeah.

Lorna Gager (41m 35s):
Yeah. And it comes back to fear, right. Because people want normalcy. People want what they used to have because they believe that it kept them safe. But we are as safe now as we’ve ever been, which is, you know, we’re as safe as we, you know, we have to, we have to manage that within ourselves all the time.

Christine Okezie (41m 56s):
Well, I think that brings up a great point, right. Is so it’s, it’s the grasping for control and predictability and certainty and having the answer that we’re going to be okay. You know, but all of that, as we do this work is why this work is so powerful because the answer to that is right here and now is that you are safe, that we live in a universe that has your back, you know, that everything is unfolding for our highest good, our growth and learning. We’re here to grow and learn. We’re here to grow, learn evolve. We’re not here to, you know, get a bunch of stuff in day. So it’s working. Right. And that’s the thing is that that’s why I’ve walked around. And I say, okay, I don’t know, but I guess this is correct.

Christine Okezie (42m 39s):
It’s correct. Who am I to say, this shouldn’t be happening? Who might have say, why me, well, why not? You, you know? Yeah.

Lorna Gager (42m 46s):
Yeah. And, and a lot of people have a, have a problem saying I live in a safe universe, right. That the universe is safe. The universe has my back. And I really love that. That’s one of the major things that I got from the Seth work is this notion that we are so vital and that we are here to grow and expand and love and live. And we are here for joy and purpose and that the universe is not safe. Right. We can all look around and know that the universe is not safe, but I, I live in a safe universe. I create my own dimension. I create my own bubble of my life and what I believe.

Lorna Gager (43m 28s):
And so I walk in a safe universe and those are two very distinct things.

Christine Okezie (43m 35s):
That is a very important distinction, which brings me to the fact. So we walk around you and I, and you know, in our peeps and all this, and we, we all get these, this lens that we move through life with, but there’s a lot of naysayers is a lot of people, you know, and you know, who are wonderful human beings, nonetheless, you know, but they get really annoyed with this, these kinds of concepts, you know, maybe not the people listening on this podcast, but maybe someone, we all know someone, you know, sure. Who’s going to say, Oh my God, you know, you’re walking around with Rose colored glasses, you know, it’s, you know, rainbows and unicorns, give me a break.

Christine Okezie (44m 19s):
We’ve got some important issues to be dealing with them. As you know, in this time, how do we, how do we deal with that? How do you deal with that?

Lorna Gager (44m 27s):
I mean, that’s been part of my process also for sure. And it’s as within, so without, you know, I think for a long time I wanted to convince people. I wanted the validation of what I believed and I felt like I needed to put it on other people. And why don’t you see what I see? And this is so obvious and because it is very obvious to me and it’s, it’s a knowing I hold it in my bones, but part of my journey has been to recognize that other people have their journeys and to be okay with wherever anyone else is, which as we know is the very hardest with our immediate family. Yes. And, you know, am I a hundred percent in a way, but I am way, way better than I have been.

Lorna Gager (45m 12s):
And I do have a sense of peace around it. And even if I kind of lose it in the moment, I will find it again very quickly because I do know that everyone is here on their own soul path. And it is theirs is as important as mine, even when I don’t understand it.

Christine Okezie (45m 30s):
Yes. Thank you. And that knowing goes a long way. I think in, you know, bridging the gap in, in with a lot of things that are going on these days, you know, conversations and different belief systems, you know, and I think it also allows us when you said, you know, we kind of understand that everybody’s on their own path. Everybody’s going through their own soul lesson. Right. It stops us from othering, you know, good. They’re, they’re good. They’re bad. Oh, they must be evil. You know, because we can have those thoughts and trust me, we, I do.

Christine Okezie (46m 10s):
Right. But to your point, it doesn’t feel good. It doesn’t feel good to stay there and it doesn’t feel good to make, you know, evil, evil, evil, evil, they’re horrible. Oh my God. It’s, you know, I have that. And then what if, what else is true is what I always bring myself back to? You know, what else is true? What else do I know

Lorna Gager (46m 30s):
Exactly? And what we know is that we are all part of this quantum field. We are all one. We are all source. We are all, all it is. We are all God. However, however you want to put that. And no matter how that other person is dressed up, they are God. And they hold something for us and they hold something in us. And no matter what, how destructive or horrible I may think a person is being that person is also me. I am them and they are me. And it is there for me to learn something for me to grow for some bigger plan that I don’t understand, but it’s not for me to, you know, for me to judge it and other, it is against myself because what I do to another, I do to myself.

Lorna Gager (47m 20s):
Oh, wow.

Christine Okezie (47m 21s):
Okay. That’s really a powerful one. Thank you. How bad is it when we do go down the rabbit hole and get stuck in fear and anger and resentment?

Lorna Gager (47m 30s):
Yeah. I think this is a really important point, Christine, because it is so important that we feel what we feel and in our society and a lot of ways that we grew up, it was all about suppression. It was all about, you know, cry somewhere, private, you know, I don’t don’t have these bad feelings, don’t show these bad feelings. And we really got this message that anything negative was just not to be dealt with, not to be shown. And that, that causes us to have a lot of work to do when we grow up and start looking at these things. Yes. And you, and I always say that, you know, we don’t want to make ourselves wrong for any of it.

Lorna Gager (48m 12s):
We want the, if we feel it, we can move through it and we can let it go. It’s the not feeling it that keeps it held in our body and keeps our vibration at a place where we don’t want it to be. And so, you know, again, I’ll talk about Matt Kahn. You know, he says, love whatever arises. And so even, you know, the, the point of the self-love is not just to love the parts that are all pretty and sparkly and that we show to the people that we want to impress truly loving ourselves is loving all the, you know, the awful parts, the parts that we’re not proud of, the parts that we’re ashamed of. And until we can incorporate all of those parts of ourselves, we can’t, we can’t unconditionally love ourselves.

Christine Okezie (48m 56s):
Yeah. Yeah. The parts of us that make us cringe, right. Those are the parts that we need to befriend, you know, pull out of the drawer, welcome and say, Hm, you know, how can I love this part? Or, you know, how can I forgive this part? You know, because it it’s here,

Lorna Gager (49m 15s):
Right? Yeah. Yeah. And this is where a friends and women’s circles can be so, so helpful because when we start to allow ourselves to share these things in evitable, people say, you’re not alone. I feel the same way I’ve experienced that. And it can just, it can just make it a little bit easier for us to accept it in ourselves because we very easily had accepted in other people. Yeah. Why can’t we give it to ourselves as well? Beautiful.

Christine Okezie (49m 42s):
Yes. And that’s the healing and that’s again, that’s. So when we talk about all of these universal laws, law of attraction and manifestation they’re are always geared to, well, how can I create a healthier, happier, you know, more abundant life? And the truth is that’s why these laws are that powerful because it puts the power back inside of us. Right. It gives us the ability to say, wait, life, isn’t happening for you, you know, to you, it’s happening for you. Can I, you know, be conscious enough? Can I be self-aware to recognize that it, everything I’m looking for, you know, the good, bad, and the ugly is here.

Lorna Gager (50m 20s):
Yes. Yes. And it’s very empowering and you and I are all about empowering women and, and everyone, but it’s interesting in this time right now, because you know, there’s a lot of talk about sovereignty. There’s a lot of talk about self-empowerment and freedom and it can also get taken to an extreme yes. A kid and, you know, I am all about, you know, making sure that I’m happy. Right. And I’m all about, you know, wanting what I want and not feeling badly about getting what I want and all of those things, but never at the expense of other people. Okay.

Lorna Gager (50m 59s):
And, you know, yes, I am sovereign. Yes. I have my freedom. Yes. I have. I am empowered, but not to the effect that I’m going to do something that is going to put someone else in fear or danger. Yeah. And you know, I’m talking about masks right now, and I think it’s so important to recognize that, like, you know, and again, it comes back to, we are all one, why would I put anyone else in danger? Why would I put them in fear when I know that that’s just an extension of me. Right. And I, and I don’t want them align the people who believe that we shouldn’t wear masks because they have something in them that feels powerless and feels like they are being taken over by something and they have to fight against that.

Lorna Gager (51m 43s):
And that is for them to look at, and that is for them, you know, they’re on their path and we have this mask, no mask situation for greater learning for all of us. Absolutely. Yes. Personally, I am very, very comfortable knowing that my truth is that, you know, I can, I can have both of those things. I can manifest what I want in my life and still very much care about what happens to other people. So

Christine Okezie (52m 9s):
You go back to that. I mean, ultimately we are one, right. And, and that kind of cuts through most of our othering and most of our, you know, well, you know, they, they’re just not enlightened enough. You know, I mean, in this, this is the thing is I call it my own movie. Right. We talk about this a lot, like my movie. Right. So I’m literally very aware that I’m in a movie and the scenes that are being played out, you know, the lines that are getting, you know, repeated over and over again, you know, they’re there for me. I mean, there’s, you know, so I’m really curious to say, okay, why is this popping into my movie right now? You know, and that’s a very different way to experience or relate to everything in your life.

Christine Okezie (52m 55s):
You know, health issues, relationship issues, family issues, right?

Lorna Gager (53m 2s):
Yes. It’s when we can step away from being in the, this is happening to me and why is this happening to me and feeling a victim of it to stepping outside of it and saying, okay, what’s in this for me. Why is this happening? And I’m not a victim. So there must be something here for me and being conscious of the things that are happening around us and having that different lens, that for a long time, and for many people still is not available to them.

Christine Okezie (53m 35s):
And you and I have talked a lot about, so we walk our, you know, our, our life with that lens. It’s also helped me a lot. And we, you know, we talk about our, you know, family and it’s helped me

Lorna Gager (53m 52s):
Kind of

Christine Okezie (53m 53s):
Give people in my life, their own space to work out whatever it is they’re working out. Right. Because I know they need to work it out, just like I need to work on my stuff, you know, I can, and, and it’s, it’s particularly challenging with kids.

Lorna Gager (54m 6s):
Hmm. So challenging. And I always come back to, you know, understanding that if someone comes in swoops in and takes care of all my problems, I’m going to feel like I’m not capable of doing that for myself. Right. I’m going to feel like I need to be taken care of. I’m not going to be in my sovereignty and in my power. Yes. And so as much as we may feel, we want to fix and we want to heal and we want to take care of it. And like, I can fix that. I know I’ve been through that. We’re not giving that person the benefit of the doubt that they can do it themselves. Right. Because we’re basically saying your discomfort is making me so uncomfortable that I have to fix you.

Lorna Gager (54m 48s):
Yes. Right. Which is really something about us, us, and, you know, and giving that person the, you know, we’ve learned the most through experience. We learn the most through difficult things. Right. Which is another reason not to, you know, fight when we are in the struggle, but to find the learning so that we can get it over with more quickly and to recognize that a lot of people don’t have that perspective and they’re gonna, they’re gonna be struggling for awhile. And that’s okay. Yes.

Christine Okezie (55m 21s):
And again, I think another tenant of this, we talk a lot about the stuff that’s going on in the spiritual and, you know, health, Phyllis stick communities is, is all of, you know, kind of the spiritual ego, you know, that goes on as if that in itself is like the biggest virus going through like our community. Right.

Lorna Gager (55m 39s):
Absolutely. We just traded a third dimensional ego for spiritual ego. Right. Exactly. And when we just think, Oh, well, we are superior to everybody. And, you know, we know these things and that’s just, it’s just ego in another, with another mask on. And ego is very, you know, and let me say, like, I, we also, I do not believe that we are meant to get rid of our ego in any way, shape or form. We are meant to integrate our ego into ourselves so that it is not in control. It is not in the driver’s seat.

Christine Okezie (56m 9s):
Thank you for that. Yeah. It’s really about, again, this notion of embodying these principles. And if you start to kind of work with the fact that you’re responsible, you know, your thoughts and your emotions are really, really powerful, you know, you know, if, if you just start with the things that go through your head, if you just start with, you know, the, I, I used to constantly call myself an idiot, you know, any little thing I did, you’re such an idiot. You’re such an, you know, and like, would I speak to my child that way when I speak, when I speak to anyone that way I literally would not speak to anyone that way. And here I was saying that it’s kind of makes me cringe now. Yeah. And so I, so I decided to change the word and I started calling myself silly.

Christine Okezie (56m 55s):
That was silly. You know, you dropped that again. And you broke. That was silly and, and silly and idiot are two very different feeling words. Absolutely. And you know, that in itself just added so much compassion to my world. Yeah. That one, you know, little things can make such a huge difference. Yeah. Yeah. For me, it’s, you know, no, I gave up the, why’s this happening for, you know, why is this happening to me? Why is this happening? This shouldn’t be happening to, Hmm. This is happening. I wonder what’s in it for me. What am I supposed to see here? Right. And maybe I never get that answer, but it’s that pivot, you know, that, that makes all the difference in terms of my next, you know, what, how I move through it.

Christine Okezie (57m 38s):
So, right. I mean, if you think of it somatically, it’s again, you know, it’s like girding yourself versus allowing, you know, and relaxing into it. Yes. Thank you. Okay. So if you had a billboard, Lorna, what would it say?

Lorna Gager (57m 58s):
Love yourself? That’s it? It’s not complicated. I mean, it it’s, it’s not, it’s simple. It’s not easy. Yes. Yes.

Christine Okezie (58m 9s):
Thank you. Okay. Thank you so much. So where can our listeners find you and what you do online? Lorna, you can find me at Very simple. Awesome. And in addition, we’ve talked a lot today about universal universal laws. And I know I threw it around a lot, but you can find a free ebook that can be downloaded. That goes more in depth on three universal laws that are not law of attraction.

Lorna Gager (58m 36s):
Awesome. Yeah. And it’s a fabulous primer and a really, you know, kind of rich information source for anybody looking to dive a little deeper and, you know, make this work for themselves in their life.

Christine Okezie (58m 47s):
So it’s that. Okay. All right. Thanks again.

Lorna Gager (58m 50s):
Absolutely. Take care.

Christine Okezie (58m 52s):
Bye Bye

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